In the UK, we celebrate Black History Month every October to honour the legacy and contributions of Black people to British society. How important is to you that the charity sector celebrates it? 

I think it's important to take a step back when we talk about Black History Month, not just for the charity sector, but for society overall. I think those of us who are of African, Caribbean and mixed heritage, do contemplate why our historical contributions to this country are concentrated in just one month. African heritage presence in this country goes back to Roman times. That's a very long legacy, but that history isn't part of the curriculum in this country.  I just want to put that in context. 

So given that our contributions aren’t necessarily acknowledged, recognised or celebrated, to have the one month is very important. It allows us to showcase the contributions we make, and to celebrate the people behind them. And I do believe the charity sector in particular should celebrate these contributions because we know that Black communities in the UK are very active in the sector, not just as recipients but as givers. We start and run essential community organisations, are an integral part of an important volunteer force that fuels the nonprofit sector; and we are at the grassroots. 

Black teachers, nurses, entrepreneurs and others who came in the 50s as the Windrush generation, and even further back, have made important contributions to the UK society. So yes, it's right that we celebrate them, but we hope that there will be a day when Black history is just British history, seen as an entwined part of this country. 

In 1989, Kimberlé Crenshaw introduced the concept of intersectionality to describe the experiences of Black women, adding the lens of ethnicity to a debate that was solely focused on gender.  

The Black Funding Network was created by 4 highly accomplished Black women. What parts of your experience as a Black woman leading in the charity sector do you think the sector has yet to recognise? In other words, do you think to some degree your experience is still somewhat invisible? 

There's a lot of discussion around understanding what lived experience is within the charity sector, and I think intersectionality is a really important concept. There has been an early focus on gender just because actually women are not the minority in this country (if you look at it from a purely statistical point of view) and still suffered tremendous discrimination. So, fighting for gender equality has been a longer standing campaign for justice.  

Then when you add a racial and ethnicity lens, you have another dimension. The role of Black women in society is amongst the least acknowledged. 

But there are many other intersectionalities, like social class – and this country has an intense class structure – and sexual orientation. So if you're a Black, queer female, from a working class background, that's a whole other dimension of experience. Add to this other aspects as well, such as the lens of disability or neurodiversity, among others. 

So we all need to recognise where people come from and what they bring to the conversation. If you come from a position of privilege and of power, naturally that's what you will bring to the debate. Understanding what we bring – that's the conversation we have to have. That's the real debate, particularly in the philanthropic and charitable sectors. There’s an imbalance between power and privilege versus live experience and all of those intersectionalities. A lot of progress has definitely been made in the past few years, but there's still such a long way to go. 

Further on your question about how the Black Funding Network was founded, we were four Black women who got together post the impact of Covid and the murder of George Floyd on our communities on top of historic under funding of grassroots organisations to say “we know something needs to be done”. People come to us to ask what needs to be done, where does our help need to go?, So we decided to do something within our means to galvanise ways to support the small Black-led community organisations that don't get support from most mainstream funders.  

We wanted to build an intentional community of giving, and seeing the success of The Funding Network, we knew it could be done. So we just rolled up our sleeves and did it. – and I'm going to say, Black women roll up our sleeves and get it done all the time. I'm very happy and proud to be amongst these women. 

When we talk about social change, we often recognise that a combination of factors are needed for this to happen. How do you see the complementarity of education and funding/donations to achieve social justice? 

One of the founding principles of the Black Funding Network – besides obviously raising funds for these organisations – is to shine a light on the challenges Black communities face in the UK. We also wanted to showcase the amazing work that's getting done and the people who are doing it. So education for us is really important. 

It’s important to understand how something like dyslexia or ADHD impacts and shows up in our communities.  How exclusion from school, access to work and training manifests in our communities. How important wellbeing and mental health are.  

We wanted people to know what the dilemmas, the challenges and the opportunities are. That's the other thing. When people come to our events, they meet the organisations we're supporting and learn about the amazing work that gets done, and the people behind that work. All of a sudden there’s a sense of faith, trust and confidence – this has a multiplier effect. The feedback we get from the organisations that we have supported is that being visible and getting the support for what they're doing just gives them the confidence to be bold and go further. 

Your background is in finance, and you’re now focused on social investment. In large part, The Funding Network model is similar to venture capital insofar as we fund the charities when they’re too small for larger funders.  

How do you see social investment bridging the gap in societal issues and how does it align with philanthropy?  

Oh that's a really big question…! 

There's a spectrum of funding. At one end is philanthropic capital generally given as grants to charitable organisations. Importantly, this is money not expected to be paid back. It’s given sometimes for a very specific purpose or under very specific terms, but again not repayable. At the other end is commercial funding, mostly loans from a funder or bank. The in-between is the spectrum of social investing from angel investors, who may want equity, to funders providing concessionary loan terms. 

These funds are given primarily to social purpose organisations (not necessarily charities and that's an important trend which I endorse), but on terms more easily accepted by a nonprofit organisation. And then there are some social investment, so-called impact investment, which are closer to commercial terms, including the returns expected, but with a slightly more structured delivery. So that is the spectrum. 

There have been some attempts to put more trusts and foundations, and philanthropic capital in general, towards social investment, but I find that a little problematic. The needs, particularly of the small nonprofits like the ones TFN and we support, need that sort of non- repayable funding. While some of them will have business models that can develop and be income generating and then move in that direction, many can't – that's just not the way they are set up and they have to be supported because of the reach they have. 

I do think that there is a desperate need for philanthropic funding that is non repayable, that does reach those organisations that are really working at the grassroots and community level. We know that many trusts and foundations are not deploying much of their funds into communities and keep very healthy endowments as primarily investment vehicles 

And social investment is only an option if you’re even able to participate. Most small organisations are under resourced, living off of volunteer oxygen, and the hoops you have to go through to even apply for that type of funding or any anything like that is just non-feasible. Even if you're slightly bigger and have some resources – and I know some organisations that are – it’s difficult to manoeuvre through that process. It ends up being just for those organisations that are quite established and know the ropes and know the people, who get through time and again. This is why the sense of a power imbalance and injustice in some ways is perpetuated. 

I know  some philanthropic organisations are really working hard to simplify their processes and make themselves more accessible. There's good work being done in this area, but again, it's there's still a lot to be done. 

Social investment has models and products that can support these purposeful organisations. I do think that these investors need to be mindful of their own power in those relationships. A number are looking to support work focused on social justice, racial justice, economic justice, climate change, etc. They obviously want to invest so there is a future pipeline and to support organisations to be resilient in the long term. That is why we need blended finance; we need the spectrum of finance. 

Lastly, you are a member of The Funding Network. What do you see as the value of TFN for the charity sector more broadly?  

I go back to one of my other hats. In addition to BFN I am also co-founder of GiveBLACK. We did an important examination into Black philanthropy in the UK, Valuing the Black Philanthropic Pound, and in talking to Black philanthropists, or would be philanthropists, we realised that there was a lot of resistance to the word philanthropy. It was seen as elitist and “not for us”. 

So I was always struck by TFN, and one of the reasons why I shamelessly borrowed their model for Black Funding Network, was that the concept of collective giving is very powerful, especially when we are supporting smaller organisations. Being able to bring to bear generosity amongst a group of people who come together wanting to support the organisations being represented – it is impactful and joyful. Collective giving is something that should be much more prevalent than it is, especially here. There are so many different organisations, groups, needs that could be supported through the model of a giving circle. 

This form of generosity is really contagious. And I think TFN has done a really good job in showcasing what influence such giving has. I think this model supported a diversity of a broad base of organisations which is really important because so many charities operate in different spheres. What TFN has done is to bring people together who share a desire to support an eclectic mix of organisations, and that's how something like Black Funding Network was born. Some of the organisations that TFN had supported were Black-led – and I was very happy to nominate several – but I knew that there were so many more, so I decided to be more intentional.  

TFN has helped nurture an Environmental Funding Network, an LGBTQ network, and others. 

I got introduced to TFN because they supported a youth network of social entrepreneurs which was fantastic. The concept of just coming together because you really want to know where your generosity – from the smallest amount of money to the largest – is directed, I commend TFN for that. 

Thank you. These were all the questions that I had prepared and thank you so much for giving thought to them. Is there anything else you'd like to cover that I didn't ask? 

Going back to the first question about Black History Month, the theme this year was ‘Saluting our Sisters’ and I just want to pay tribute to the generations of Black women that – from Mary Seacole over 100 years ago to Colleen Amos OBE today –  have made immense contributions. There are so many, but sadly mostly so invisible. I think we should always, and the charitable sector must too, go back to your original question and take the time to celebrate the women who have made such a difference in the charitable sector. 

To know more about The Black Funding Network visit the website.  

Disclaimer: Inês Ribeiro spoke with Patricia Hamzahee via Microsoft Teams on 2 November 2023. This interview has been lightly edited for length and clarity.